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Thursday 21 November 2013

Contradiction of Symmetry

When I was thinking about the symmetry in nature, I ended with a contradiction.

First of all what I meant by symmetry is the symmetry in nature. It is that if you do an experiment at your house and if you do the same experiment at your school with same initial conditions, then it will give you the same result.  The experiment can be either physics or chemistry.

For example, if you throw a ball with an initial velocity with some initial conditions it will attain some final velocity. With same initial conditions if you throw the same ball with same initial velocity, from the equations of motion the ball will attain the same final velocity. No matter whether this experiment is done at India or U.S.A or China or Russia, the experiment will give same result. The rule is just the initial conditions should be kept the same.
            Similar kind of example can be given in chemistry.
A chemical process at certain temperature, pressure and other state variables at some value will give same result if the experiment is done with same initial conditions anywhere in the Universe.
Simply it can be said that,
          
          Any process with same initial conditions will give same result independent of place or time. That is any process is symmetrical about space and time.

This symmetry is the base of our entire Science knowledge. If the universe doesn’t follow this symmetry principle, our world would be a big confusion.

The symmetry principle just states that,

         “The Universe that is the Nature follows some specific rules”.
          And Physics is nothing but the study of these rules of the Universe.

But there is contradiction, when you apply this theory in Biology. As per the Science of Biology, human body can be considered as the combination of DNA, RNA and other things. Basically speaking,

Human body is simply the different combination of molecules in Nature. The whole body can be divided into molecules and atoms.
If it could be considered that human body can be created from these tiny molecules, which is like a building created by stones, bricks, rods, cement then the whole of the human body could be built just with molecules.

Let us say it was found a machine to make desired molecules with atoms and that machine can build any structure of any set of molecules in Nature [like building things in Lego game - shown below]. Then it is possible to build human body as a building construction from top to bottom or centre part to side parts. And also let us say all these things are done with same initial conditions as it were build inside a woman’s womb.

Thus let us assume that we able to build two humans with all molecules and atoms at same positions.

Why I need to build these two because clones also may have small differences in their structure. Though DNA, RNA and other things be the same, it would not be exact same. Some small molecules may be in different positions.

But here it was assumed that the two humans build with this machine are exactly the same. That is like an exact printed copy.  
I called the two humans as two experiments. Since both humans are exactly the same, both are same experiments with same initial conditions.
Now I put these two experiments [two humans] at different places of the world.

[Notice that the initial conditions are exactly the same as they were the exact clones and it is fair to say the two humans as experiment because they are nothing but just the mixture of chemical compounds of tiny molecules. Both have same Genes and everything the same.]

Since their initial conditions are all same, they should think exactly the same. But it will not happen at all.

If the first one [first experiment] was put in a market full of crowds, he will start to think about that crowds and may fear about the people and will think who they are.

[These two are like newly born children. They don’t have anything stored in their mind. Their minds are purely fresh and non-polluted.]

And if the second one [second experiment] was put in a room with no people, he will start to think about that whole place and will start to fear where he is. He will be somewhat amused and feared.
This is the contradiction I end up with.

Both are the exactly the same experiment with same initial conditions but had been put on different places in space and time. They didn’t think exactly in a same way. The outside world affected the symmetry principle.
This may happen if they two were brought up in empty space also. 
Somewhat it makes me confusing.

And this is what I want to finally convey,

Whether Symmetry really exists in nature?  
Please give your opinions about this contradiction. 

6 comments:

  1. The outcomes are the same as it may be with the ball. The ball bumps into different molecules. It's outer composition (airborne pathogens, etc, etc) would be different. But, just as the ball drops to it's final state of rest, the person eventually does also. They die. That's if I'm permitted to view the complexity of their interactions as a start and an end point.

    It could be considered differently. From production of the ball and the human to their inevitable demise. That may not work, as the ball's chemical composition is different than the humans. So we're kinda forced to an "ultimate" level to compare them. Matter organized then disorganized. Organized into a ball and a human being. Each throw being some activity in the balls continued existence -- akin to the humans. The ball goes to the park with it's friends, the human get's married. They eventually fall into disuse (the human body dies and decays, and the ball "breaks down"). They return to their base constituents, etc, etc.

    Eventually they all meet the same ends (entropy). So, it depends on what lens it's being viewed through. Though I agree with the overall point. We complex chemical reactions -- for the most part -- do a host more before we come to rest. And still do "something" while falling back to our base constituents.

    Donno. ::shrug::

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  2. Yeah.. I think humans are somehow different from other usual chemical compounds and physical objects because it doesn't behave as same in everywhere. The final stage or initial stage or each stage of a ball can be determined by just knowing the physical laws they are following. But in the case of humans, it cannot be determined. Their total chemical reactions happening in their brain is somewhat different from other objects in Universe.
    Thank you very much for posting your opinions !!

    ReplyDelete
  3. The initial external conditions are not the same. Each human will get different inputs (eg hear,see,smell). based on the different surroundings they are placed in. Much like when doing a chemical experiment, If the initial compounds are the same but the temperature of the external systems are different, then you will end up with two different out comes. However if you where to place both humans in different identical rooms. Where each external variable behaved the same continieusly through out the experiment. then i believe they would behave the exact same.

    Does make me think though what if you where to place them in the same identical room. exactly opposide each other, in identical positions and state. Would they then ever be able to think different thoughts? How would one person be able to percieve a variable different than the other??

    Interesting post, got me thinking:)

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  4. First of all thank you very much for your opinion. You think exactly in a same way, how i thought.
    I thought the same. I understood that the initial conditions are not the same since the inputs smell, sound, visuals are different and they affect the chemical process in our mind and so they will behave like different chemical process.
    That is the 5 senses makes us to think different.

    Then i thought again the same experiment in empty space, where there is no sound, smell, taste (chemical effects), touching (external effect on our skin), and light (being the empty space). Now will they think the exactly in a same way?

    I think they will not because if they think exactly in a same way, then each of the person (experiment) should walk or do the same. That is, if the first person put his left leg forwards to walk then the second person should also put his left leg from the symmetry principle, being the same chemical reaction. But will they put the same leg ?

    I don't think it is a must for both of them to walk by the starting of the same leg, though they think the same. We should consider not only thinking process, but both mental and physical process.

    And anyway once again thanks for the opinion sir.

    ReplyDelete
  5. You're welcome. I do find it an interesting notion. Far beyond idea's of correctness or incorrectness, there's a thought experiment happening. When I'm hashing out these thoughts with my friends, we don't think about right and wrong. We're thinking. You start with some postulation, and you work through it. So maybe I should be thanking you. I read the post and begun to think. :)

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  6. Yeah. All these are thought experiments. We cannot do it in real life. But these thought experiments may lead to great conclusions.

    ReplyDelete

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